This post has received numerous comments and through all of them I’ve yet to see anyone give scripture that convinces me that cursing brings glory to God.

I suppose that when it comes down to it I think about this:

Eph 4:29 Let no foul or polluting language, nor evil word nor unwholesome or worthless talk [ever] come out of your mouth, but only such [speech] as is good and beneficial to the spiritual progress of others, as is fitting to the need and the occasion, that it may be a blessing and give grace (God’s favor) to those who hear it.

1Co 10:23 All things are legitimate [permissible--and we are free to do anything we please], but not all things are helpful (expedient, profitable, and wholesome). All things are legitimate, but not all things are constructive [to character] and edifying [to spiritual life].

I’m a freshman at a Christian liberal arts university. Unlike most freshmen, coming to college has actually SAVED my faith. Why? Because I’m allowed to be myself. Over the summer, I was struggling with this issue. I had Christians telling me it was not good, Christians telling me it was ok, non-Christians telling me not good, and non-Christians telling me it was ok. I felt pulled in 4 different directions. I did a lot of soul searching over the summer and this fall, and I have decided that I will not get down on myself for saying a cuss word here and there because that was the cause of my doubt about staying a Christian. I think God would prefer my remaining a devoted follower of HIs who sometimes cusses over being a down-trodden use-to-be Christian. All Jesus has commanded me to do is to continue to profess Him as my Savior and to love Him and others. I am honestly grateful to Jesus for what He did for me. Even as I say that, my heart feels uplifted. I know God is well aware that I may say a few cuss words. I actually prayed about it.

I had the amazing blessing of going to Australia two summers ago on a mission trip with my church. The Christians there cuss up a storm but yet they are fully devoted to God. I met a high-school age girl who was beaten up everyday at school for being a Christian. Christians there are treated like lower class people. So what if they cuss? Their devotion to Christ is definitely evident. They’re martyrs in my book and most likely in God’s book.

Here a couple of passages I live by.

“As a prisoner for the Lord, then, I urge you to live a life worthy of the calling you have received. Be completely humble and gentle; be patient, bearing with one another in love. Make every effort to keep the unity of the Spirit through the bond of peace. There is one body and one Spirit—just as you were called to one hope when you were called— one Lord, one faith, one baptism; one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.” – Ephesians 4:1-6

“Don’t pick on people, jump on their failures, criticize their faults— unless, of course, you want the same treatment. That critical spirit has a way of boomeranging. It’s easy to see a smudge on your neighbor’s face and be oblivious to the ugly sneer on your own. Do you have the nerve to say, ‘Let me wash your face for you,’ when your own face is distorted by contempt? It’s this whole traveling road-show mentality all over again, playing a holier-than-thou part instead of just living your part. Wipe that ugly sneer off your own face, and you might be fit to offer a washcloth to your neighbor.” – Matthew 7:1-5 (The Message)

Thanks for the intelligent explanations based on the Scriptures.

This is such an important issue, and almost NOBODY talk about it!

Blessings.

Ilu Williams

My dad uses the “I cuss to bring glory to God in evangilizing to others who would otherwise not hear a word of it” excuse. Do I even need to point out that he cusses so much more, and I suspect he doesn’t even realize it?

I have an issue with eating, as zach said. And even though I recognize it… and hate it… something in me keeps me eating and eating, and even more so when I’m around other people who are seeing this example I set! I keep praying and praying, and hopefully this nice little proverb about a knife to the throat being better than this overindulgence (very paraphrased) will help… and some good undeserved grace from God of course.

My wife, what little money she has to spend, shops, and shops, and gets on line and shops some more. Even with no money, she shops for the things she’s going to shop for when she does get a couple bucks.

I can say, at least in my and my wife’s case, we recognize the sin… which may be better or worse… but I have high hopes it’s a step into turning away from it… anyway this could get really deep so here’s what I was getting at:

Thank God, OH Thank God that in spite of how filthy we are He still has saved us. The main reason I look forward to heaven is that my understanding is *I* will no longer be a sinner…. Thank you God. Thank you.

So I’ll keep this short. There’s nothing wrong with swearing, unless it’s directed at another person. But one must remember there is a tme and a place for everything.

Amazing how some people think God would be so petty. For those of you who think the occasional foul word is sinful, how about being overweight? As the body is a temple, is this not a sin as well? Funny, I don’t see too many pastors preaching sermons that condemn obesity.

Example: You’s hammering a nail into the wall, miss, and hit your finger. “Aw, shit!” Or you eat a horrible meal at a restaurant and later that night say the food was “kinda sh*tty.” There’s nothing bad about that. It’s descriptive, maybe somewhat vulgar but it’s being used in private. And one must remember there is a time and a place for everything.

On the other hand, screaming profanity at another person in anger, or using a profanity to describe another person (“That a**hole!”) would clearly be sin.

Perhaps you have to think about it in this way: WWJD. Jesus was a man, divine, but still had human qualities. Do I believe he used the occasional swear word? Maybe. A mouth like a sailor? Doubt it. Did he direct swear words towards others? No.

Further, does anyone think God wants them to spend time splitting hairs an pondering what words are “cuss words” and what are not? Gluteus, bottom, butt, ass…Get real!

I think your on a slippery slope here. Just because you’re not perfect doesn’t mean God doesn’t expect your best. This is the catch 22 of God’s law: he demands perfection yet it is impossible for us to reach it. That’s what Jesus was for. You talk about feeling convicted for using certain words. People having different convictions for things like word usage, drinking, giving, etc. but if you have those convictions and then choose to ignore them and say “Well I can’t be perfect anyway, so who cares”, then that is sin. One person might have a conviction not to watch a certain movie, but if he feels this and then decides to watch it, that’s wrong too. Obviously we need to constantly be checking our convictions and actions with what the Bible says (we can’t just use the “I feel this is right” standard), but like it or not, not every moral or ethical issue is spelled out in the Bible. In many situations, we need to use its words and come to our own conclusions about what the right thing to do is. However, if you conclude on a right action and then choose to disobey, you’re still in the wrong.

Also, not to be condescending, but you’re going to have a very hard time convincing me or anyone else that using or not using certain words makes anyone more or less worshipful, especially words that you admit you have convictions not to use.

Lastly, my argument was not that certain words are worse or that certain words are better. Words are words; its a person’s context and meaning that gives the words their power.

Typed on my ipod touch so please excuse the typos.

keep up the good work man…….

Although, it’s a similiar situation with the topic of alcohol. I personally enjoy a beer now and then, but responsibly. I’ve never been drunk and never intend to be. However, I’m also careful about who I do this around and who I talk about it with. Not because I’m ashamed or hiding, but because I don’t want to be a stumbling block for anyone else. I also don’t want to come across to other Christians as “Hey, I do this, and I’m allowed. What are you gonna do about it?” I just try to exercise self-control.

Let me start off by saying that 22, and I’ve already worked in some places where some people tend to use more colorful language on a regular basis. One point I want to make first is that for me, the constant use of “curse” words simply makes a person just come off as uneducated and a simpleton. I’m not advocating that anything and everything goes.

However, when I read the verses on rotten language, I think the author is trying to get at something deeper. It’s already been mentioned here, but I’m talking about motive. All throughout the New Testiment, the Bible states that we Christians are now under the spirit of the law and not the letter of the law.

2 Cor. 3:6 He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant—not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

When the previous reference was talking about rotten language, I don’t the Bible is talking about specific words. Let me take another detour. I have an Aunt Karen who has Down’s syndrome; because of this, she has partial mental retardation. In today’s PC world, the term “mental retardation” is now frowned upon. It’s not because there is something wrong with the word, but too many people were using it in vulgar ways. My mom (my aunt’s sister) finds it offensive when people say Karen is mentally retarded, however the definition of mentally retarded is identical to mentally challenged. I refrain from the former around my mother simply because it makes her feel uncomfortable. However, just because I don’t use this word around my mother doesn’t mean I think it’s taboo.

Maybe some of you will disagree with me here, but I believe if you can replace a word by its definition and the newly formed phrase is not offensive, then the original shouldn’t be either. One example as already stated above to exhaustion would be the word ass. If some is simply referring to you hind quarters in a normal way, I see no reason why the word ass would be considered rotten or vulgar. The phrase literally has the exact same meaning. I have a feeling for a lot of people are more offended by the sound of the word ass then by what it actually represents. The Bible (at least mine) contains the word ass several times, however its referring to a donkey. From this I’ll conclude that there is nothing inherently wrong with the sound of the word ass (stick with me here, I know this is kind of rambling). The other problem would be with its meaning. However, its meaning is inherently bad either. The only other option to go with is context. In a situation were someone is using the word in a context were one of its synonyms would be approprite, I feel I must conclude the same for the “curse” word itself.

Like I said before, I’m not advocating everything and anything goes. However you also have to look at the converse of the above argument. It’s very possible (and probably happens daily) for one person to tear another person down uses just words that are never considered offensive anywhere. What comes to my mind is “Driving Miss Daisy”, a movie I personally like. Throughout the movie, Miss Daisy treats Hoke like a child and a jerk through her constant complaining and bickering. She doesn’t use any bad words (at least I don’t think she did) but her language would definitely be considered rotten towards Hoke.

For me personally I find a few words rather offensive. One word in particular that is used to describe a woman as a dog. I don’t really like when people use it. Not when they’re referring to women or when they’re using it in other forms either.

In closing, I just want to look at the rotten language verse again and ask, is the writer trying to keep us from certain words, is he trying to keep us from talking in evil ways in general (talking meanly or putting someone down), or is it both? It’s pretty obvious that it’s not the first one, because that would be implying a finite list of dos and do nots, and that beyond that you could talk as you please. Could it be both? Well, if he was, then he’s basically saying “watch the overall context of your language and make sure your speech is edifying to other, except in situation x,y,z where context doesn’t matter.” That seems kind of odd, to make a general statement about context and then follow it up with some exceptions to the rule. I don’t think the Bible is about that. Therefore, I’m concluding that the author wanted us to watch the overall context of the language and to be careful of the meaning of our speech.

Let me iterate one final time that I’m not advocating anything and everything goes. Paul mentions that certain actions that are permissible can be stumbling blocks for others. Christians need to always be careful with the words they use, as it is a reflection on the church and Christ. However to state that a word in and of itself is evil or sinful is not an idea I believe the bible supports.

1.Let me state again my position, works of the Law are not required to be saved, however obediance to Christ is. You seem to igore my distinction between them. Paul’s reference to ‘works’ that do not save is works of the law, this is what he means by ‘of your selves’ in reference to ephesians 2:8. I can say this since he makes a similar reference to works of the law being of ourselves in Philipians 3:9. Gal 3:24&25 and Romans 3:28 further validate that the ‘works’ Paul refers to are works of the law (Mosaic). Never once does Paul make any indication that we are not required to obey Christ to be saved. His own conversion verifies that even he had to be baptised in water before his sins were removed Acts 22:1-16.

2. As for James and Paul. The do agree with one another. Paul never excludes the necessity to obey Christ in any of his writings (Ro 1:5,6:16&17, 15:18,16:26,2Thess 1:8). Why wouldn’t he for Christ himself required us to obey him (Matt 28:20,Luke 11:28, John 14:21,23). The other Apostles understood the necessity of obedaince as well (Acts 5:32 (Holy Spirit is given to those who obey), 1Peter 1:22 (purified yourselves by obeying the form of truth), 1Peter 4:17, 1John 2:3,2:5,3:22,3:24, Rev 3:3, 12:17, 14:12.) Jesus and all the Apostles taught the same thing faith and obedaince to God. This theme is the same through out the entire Bible and has not changed. Paul however focuses on the Faith part more and James on the necessity of Obedaince part more. Both teach the necessity of both and neither teach the necessity of Faith in and obediance to the Mosaic Law.

3. James 2:14-26 never even comes close to teaching what you have described above.

a. James 2:14-19 Asks the question; can a faith with out works save us? By asking this James has made the entire context of the passage a salvation issue. The subject in question is can we be saved by faith apart from works. He answers this question with a resounding NO. “even the demons believe and tremble’.

b. James 2:20-24 Further drives the point home that we are saved by a faith that is made complete by action. His point is that when we respond to God’s call in faith our faith is made compete and we are saved.

c. At no point does James ever define a ’saving faith’ apart from obediance to God, as you construe in the above responce.

4. You said;

‘As with any single verse or passage, we discern what it teaches by first filtering it through what we know the Bible teaches on the subject at hand. In the case of baptism and salvation or confession and salvation, the Bible is clear that salvation is by grace through faith in Jesus Christ, not by works of any kind, including baptism, or confession. Any interpretation which comes to the conclusion that baptism, or any other act, is necessary for salvation, does not consider the whole of the gospel message and is a faulty interpretation.’

a) You break your own rule in the first sentence of the above paragraph since you do not even attempt a responce at Mark 16:16, or Acts 2:38, Ro 10:8-13 which clearly teach that we are saved after we believe, repent, confess and are baptised in water.

b) Calling confession of the mouth and water baptism ‘works’ that Paul condemns as not necessary is an ignorant statement since it is clear that Paul is making reference to the works of the Law (Mosiac) and not to obediance to Christ. Confession and Baptism in water are no more works merriting salvation then is Faith. As we know Jesus even taught that Faith is the work God requires (John 6:28&29).

- If Faith is then also a ‘work’ since it is something we must now DO in order to be saved?

-If faith is a work then are we not saved because we are not saved by works?

-Does God give us the choice to believe or does he force us to believe?

-If God gives us the Choice to believe and we agree to place our faith in him or accept his faith into our lives in order to believe in him doesn’t this still mean that we play a role in accepting Christ and thus salvation still? Isn’t obediance to God and subodination to his willl and the submission of our own still necessary? If so then doesn’t this mean that we are still required to DO something inorder to be saved? If so then doesn’t that contradict the idea that we are required to do nothing?

-If faith then is an acceptable ‘work’ we are required to do then perhaps it is not the only one.

5. Your rejection of 2Corith 7:9&10 as evidence that repentance is necessary to be saved is sort of suspicious to put it mildly. Perhaps you can explain to me which one of these translations below are ok since they all teach that Godly sorrow leads to repentance that leads to salvation. Are you alone the only one able to translate the scriptures accurately. Isn’t this sort of sectarian though what has earned the JWs, Mormon, and SDAs the title of ‘cult’? Have a look

7:10 For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death. (KJV)

2 Corinthians 7:9-10 (English Standard Version)
9As it is, I rejoice, not because you were grieved, but(A) because you were grieved into repenting. For you felt a godly grief, so that you suffered no loss through us.

10For(B) godly grief produces a repentance that leads to salvation without regret, whereas(C) worldly grief produces death

2 Corinthians 7:9-10 (Contemporary English Version)
9Now I am happy, but not because I hurt your feelings. It is because God used your hurt feelings to make you turn back to him, and none of you were harmed by us. 10When God makes you feel sorry enough to turn to him and be saved, you don’t have anything to feel bad about. But when this world makes you feel sorry, it can cause your death

2 Corinthians 7:9-10 (New Century Version)
9 Now I am happy, not because you were made sad, but because your sorrow made you change your lives. You became sad in the way God wanted you to, so you were not hurt by us in any way.10 The kind of sorrow God wants makes people change their hearts and lives. This leads to salvation, and you cannot be sorry for that. But the kind of sorrow the world has brings death

2 Corinthians 7:9-10 (American Standard Version)

9 I now rejoice, not that ye were made sorry, but that ye were made sorry unto repentance; for ye were made sorry after a godly sort, that ye might suffer loss by us in nothing.

10 For godly sorrow worketh repentance unto salvation, a repentance which bringeth no regret: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.

2 Corinthians 7:9-10 (Darby Translation)

9Now I rejoice, not that ye have been grieved, but that ye have been grieved to repentance; for ye have been grieved according to God, that in nothing ye might be injured by us.

10For grief according to God works repentance to salvation, never to be regretted; but the grief of the world works death.

2 Corinthians 7:9-10 (Holman Christian Standard Bible)
9 Now I am rejoicing, not because you were grieved, but because your grief led to repentance. For you were grieved as God willed, so that you didn’t experience any loss from us. 10 For godly grief produces a repentance not to be regretted and leading to salvation, but worldly grief produces death. (A)

2 Corinthians 7:9-10 (Wycliffe New Testament)
9 now I have joy; not for ye were made sorrowful [not for ye were made sorry], but for ye were made sorrowful to penance. For why ye be made sorry after God, that in nothing ye suffer impairment of us.

10 For the sorrow that is after God, worketh penance into steadfast health; but sorrow of the world worketh death.

2 Corinthians 7:9-10 (New International Version – UK)
9 yet now I am happy, not because you were made sorry, but because your sorrow led you to repentance. For you became sorrowful as God intended and so were not harmed in any way by us.

10 Godly sorrow brings repentance that leads to salvation and leaves no regret, but worldly sorrow brings death.

2 Corinthians 7:9-10 (Today’s New International Version)
9 yet now I am happy, not because you were made sorry, but because your sorrow led you to repentance. For you became sorrowful as God intended and so were not harmed in any way by us. 10 Godly sorrow brings repentance that leads to salvation and leaves no regret, but worldly sorrow brings death.

Are all these translations poor translations? Which ones teach your doctrine?

In Christ
Shane